Behind The Stack

Bonus EP! First Quarter Favs with Renee from ItsBookTalk

• Brett Benner • Season 2 • Episode 29

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In this bonus episode Brett sits down with returning guest, Renee from ItsBookTalk where we discuss some of our first quarter favs as well as revisit books we spoke about at the beginning of the year we were looking forward to. 

Renee's instagram:https://www.instagram.com/itsbookstalk

Renee's substack: https://itsbooktalk.substack.com

Other accounts mentioned: 

Katie @: https://https://www.instagram.com/stories/basicbsguide/

Sarah @: https://fictionmatters.substack.com/

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Brett Benner:

Hello everybody and. Welcome to a bonus episode this week of Behind the Stack, where I am really happy to be sitting back down with my friend Renee from its book Talk on Instagram and its book Talk and More on her Substack, talking about first quarter faves. I can't believe the first quarter of this year is almost, well, it is over. Not almost. It is over and we've survived it. I didn't know at times if we all would, but we have so. Anyway, we have some great books we're talking about today. We each came with five choices, so enjoy this bonus episode of Behind the Stack. I am so glad to. Welcome, Renee from its book Talk and we had so much fun at the beginning of the year, which I can't even believe it was that long ago already, where we were talking about what we were looking forward to. We. This year. So today we're gonna talk about first quarter faves and what we have loved and we, we've both come today with five books out of the first quarter that we've loved. But before we get into that, I wanted us to kind of back up and talk about the books that you were looking forward to this year and see if we've covered any of them. How are you, by the way?

Renee:

Hello? Hello. I am great. Thanks for having me back. And hello listeners. Yeah, super. I I was very excited that you asked me to come back because of course I'm, I will take any opportunity to talk about favorite books and stats and all the fun good things about reading. So I'm doing great. My reading this year, so far this year. Is on fire. Oh, it's really good. I'm really happy with what I'm reading, and I don't know if it's pat myself on the back because I'm choosing just the right books for me. Mm-hmm. Which I guess I could pat myself on the back. I'm just, I'm loving it. I'm loving. Overall, the, the books that I'm reading, there's been a few disappointments, but for the most part I'm really happy.

Brett Benner:

Alright, so then backing up. Do you remember what the five books were that you originally were looking forward to?

Renee:

I do now, because when you said that, I was like, what did I, what did I say I wanted to read? Now I stand, but of course a couple of them aren't out yet, and I don't have a copy of one of them. So. I had to remind myself, I'm like, oh my gosh, yes, I forgot about that book. So anyway, I had three Wild Dogs and The Truth A Memoir by Marcus Zza. I had the Oligarch's daughter, a Thriller by Joseph Fender. I had just want you here by Meredith Turret, which is a coming of age novel. I had Flashlight by Susan Choi that comes out June 3rd, and I had the catch by Ursa Daley Ward, which also comes out June 3rd.

Brett Benner:

Okay. Okay. Okay.

Renee:

And then do you want me to tell you which one I read, or are we gonna Yeah, you can. Sure, sure, sure. It's one of my favorites so far. It's one of my top five.

Brett Benner:

Oh wow. Okay. Would, can you, I wonder

Renee:

if you could guess,

Brett Benner:

name me the last one again.

Renee:

The Catch Ursa by Ursa Daily Ward. It's hers. No, unfortunately I don't have a copy of that one, but, okay. I'll keep you in suspense till we get to our, okay. Alright, that's good. Favorites.

Brett Benner:

Okay. Okay, so my, my five were a gorgeous excitement by Cynthia Weiner Penitence by Kristin Koval Wild Dark Shore by Charlotte McConaughey. The names by Florence Knapp and the Pretender by Joe Harkin. Now. Two of these aren't out yet, which is the names and the pretenders, so I haven't read either of those yet, but the other three, I've read all of them.

Renee:

Good for you. I knew you would probably say you've already read most of yours.

Brett Benner:

I was, I was surprised actually, when I looked back to see what they were.'cause I really didn't remember until I looked up this morning and I was like, oh, okay, good. All right. I've tried desperately to get a copy of the names, but to no avail, so.

Renee:

Oh, bummer.

Brett Benner:

Well, it's been sitting in that net galley queue forever, and so that's fine. You can't get them all. So,

Renee:

no, I know. I'm waiting on the Catch The Ursa daily Ward. That one is in net galley. Pending Purgatory. Purgatory.

Brett Benner:

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So cool. So for our first quarter phases, do you wanna go over stats first? Yes. Before we get into them. Okay, cool. Why don't you start. How many books did you read total? So far?

Renee:

Right now I've read 24 that I've finished. I do have a few DNFs. Sometimes I've, I've gotten kind of far, so, but I don't count'em in my total if ID nfd anything. Yeah, I don't count them. So I've got 24 total.

Brett Benner:

Okay. And I read 32 books so far. Now, what's your audio versus your print?

Renee:

My audio is 50%, so that's 12 books, and my print is three, which is actually a lot more than I usually read in print. And then my digital is 38%, which is eight. Oh, that's so

Brett Benner:

interesting. Okay. Because

Renee:

I read a lot. I prefer my Kindle over print, so I'm actually trying to. Really, I, I just prefer reading on my Kindle most of the time. My goal, one of my goals for this year was to significantly decrease my audio, which I've done. I used to be a 80 to 85% audio.

Brett Benner:

Wow. Now, do you highlight on the Kindle?

Renee:

Yes. Yeah, I do highlight if, if it's something, yeah. I tend to highlight. Insightful sentences, things that I, I wanna really remember and maybe transfer to my commonplace notebook, which is where I keep just beautiful quotes, inspiring things. I don't highlight plot, like plot things, or I don't highlight anything that I wouldn't consider like writing that I want to keep captured.

Brett Benner:

Yeah. Okay. That's

Renee:

kind of how I highlight. Okay.

Brett Benner:

It is interesting'cause I don't have the percentages, but I did 14, 14 books on audio, so it's almost half, which surprised me when I started to go through it. The other thing I had was 18 first time authors, and I say first time authors, I should say first time. Debut authors in particular for fiction, although that's not even true because one of these people was nonfiction as well.

Renee:

That's awesome.

Brett Benner:

Yeah, but I only had one nonfiction. That's it. Which is bad. I was gonna

Renee:

ask you about that one non,'cause my nonfiction is up, which was one of my goals from last year. I was, I ended last year with only 9% nonfiction, which is not, that's not. Where I wanna be. I want to definitely be higher with nonfiction. Yeah. So right now I'm at 21%, which I believe was like, I don't remember what the story graph said. Possibly six or seven nonfiction, maybe eight. And then I'm at 79% fiction. But I am happy with that and I have, I'm bringing. Nonfiction favorites today, and they have just been stellar. I have a feeling my nonfiction this year is gonna be my highest ever. Wow. Wow. Yeah. I'm, I'm feeling it. I'm feeling nonfiction.

Brett Benner:

I was surprised'cause I was like, I swear to God I read more than this, but clearly, but I clearly didn't. So it's something I have to pay attention to moving forward.

Renee:

Well, do you think it's hard. To kind of prioritize nonfiction just because we're so immersed in fiction and that tends to be. What listeners like to hear what Bookstagram Light Bookstagram people like to see is, it's a lot of fiction, I think. What do you, do you think that,

Brett Benner:

I think you're right. I mean, I know like Tracy at the Stacks mm-hmm. You know, really focuses on nonfiction, which I think is amazing. I love nonfiction, but it has to be, I have to find it engaging and I like happen to glance over at my books right now and I have so much that I'm looking at, like for example, biblio Phobia by Sarah Shaya, like I've been reading that. I started, I just haven't finished it yet, which I don't know why'cause it's not even that long. But I'm just looking at, I just got the challenger. Book that was, you know, because so many people have been talking about that. So for whatever reason, I don't know why, but I do, I think the flashier stuff, especially for like bookstagram Sure. It's all, you know, new releases and I think there's, and, and more even leans heavily into genre fiction than anything else. Um mm-hmm. On books, Instagram with either mysteries and thrillers or romantic stuff seems to be like the forefront. Not that far, I think from book talk.

Renee:

True. Yeah.

Brett Benner:

So, but yeah, I, I always feel like when it gets to nonfiction of Amber and you make a list, and it's like, it gets about as many likes as a review. Does IE nothing?

Renee:

I know, I know. I had to and I love it and, and when I was on the podcast, I felt like I couldn't or shouldn't bring that much nonfiction because it, it just. Tends to not be something that a lot of people want to hear about, which is unfortunate. And I do, I do think that Tracy does a great job of highlighting and shouting out nonfiction and yeah, Katie and I were talking about it because Katie loves nonfiction and so maybe, maybe together ever, you know, we can try to elevate, do it, elevate nonfiction a little bit. I, funny story, I was at the library a couple days ago doing like a deep. Library search in the, within the stacks. Yeah. And so a la I had a huge pile in my hand and a lady. Stopped and was like, I love seeing other people who obviously love to read a lot. And we started chatting and I of course, you know, asked her, what do you like to read? And she was naming off Dean Kuntz and Michael Carita. I'm like, I love Michael Carita. Anyway, and then she was like, you know what I, I don't like at all. I don't like nonfiction. And I was like, really? Let me, but I could, I could really tell you some really great nonfiction to try, but people just don't. Wanna talk about non-fiction? I

Brett Benner:

think I, I I, my take on it too is people assume they hear it and think dry. Yes. And I think it it, but like, you could find a non-fiction book that's going to appeal to any person based on what their interests are. So if you're a thriller person, there are so many true crime books that you can be reading. There are

Renee:

absolutely, you know, that are

Brett Benner:

so well done. So I do think it's, I think it, it's just like, it's when, when people say, well, I don't like to read. My common response to that is. You just haven't got the book yet that pull you in. I was that same

Renee:

thing that I feel like when people say they don't like nonfiction, they just haven't found the right book.

Brett Benner:

Yeah. And it just, it's, it's a little more concentrated because you have to think, well, what do you generate towards in your normal reading? Are they thrillers? Are they mystery? You know, are they whatever? But I guarantee you, you can find something that. Is gonna be compelling in that genre anyway. Exactly. Okay. So should we get into our five books? Sure. What's your first in this, in this stellar year you've been having?

Renee:

And you know what? I will tell you, I'll start with the one that was one of my five that I told you I wanted to read back in January. Okay. And this is actually my top thriller. Uh, of the year, and it's gonna be really hard to beat. It's the Oligarchs daughter by Joseph Fender. This was the one Yeah. About Paul Brightman, who was a man on the run. He was living under an Naum name in a small New England town, and he had a million dollar bounty on his head. And one day his security is breached and he is forced to flee into the New Hampshire wilderness, to evade Russian operatives who can seemingly predict his every move. Hmm. So long story short, Paul, how did, how did he get himself in this situation? Was the fact that he had married the daughter of a Russian oligarch? And that's all I will say because obviously things happen and you know, this is a very fast paced thriller from start to finish. I could not put this down. It is jam packed with different threads and subplots, but. None of it is hard to follow, nothing. I mean, Joseph Hender is an experienced thriller writer. I've read some of his backlist. I mean, this one is stellar, though. This is stellar and I, I'm not sure why I'm not seeing more buzz about this thriller, especially among thriller readers. Because it's so good. Interesting.

Brett Benner:

Now, did you did this on audio or do you No, I read the, read this

Renee:

one on my Kindle, so I'm not sure about the audio. I, I have had some people message me who did listen to it and loved it.

Brett Benner:

Okay. All right. Great.

Renee:

So I, I think just from what they said, I, I haven't, I haven't, I haven't had any messages from people telling me they didn't like this. So it's, it's really good. So that one's the Oligarch Daughter by Joseph Fender.

Brett Benner:

All right. I'll start with something that I was on my looking forward to list. It's so funny when I was going through these and I was thinking so much of it is like, what, when I've read stuff earlier in the year, what is still resonating with me? Mm-hmm. What do I still think about? And this book was somewhat of a surprise to me in that the way it's kind of sat with me, although I, I really loved it at the time. Debut. It's a gorgeous excitement by Cynthia Weiner and. I really loved this book. I thought it was so interesting. Well, what it's about is it's a young girl in high school, well, she's applying to colleges. She's a senior living in New York City in the eighties, and kind of the debauchery of. Of New York City in the eighties growing up where your parents don't really know where you are. Running around with your groups of friends hanging out in sheep's meadow, taking a lot of drugs, having a job. But this girl who hangs out with these kids who are primarily very kind of wealthy, waspy kids, and she's very crushed out on the kind of charming boy, one of the boys of the group, who is kind of kennedyesque all American. Everything seems to be going his way. Well. One of their group, one of the girls is murdered in Central Park and found her body is found and it. Seems that it's this guy, but this doesn't happen till later. It starts with a body in the park. But the book is based on Cynthia Weiner's own experience in New York City growing up, and she was in this group of friends and one of them. Was the preppy murderer and oh, Robert Wow. Chambers. And so he was her friend and he was in this group, and so then he was caught and so. It's very loosely based on that time and those people, but it, it reminds me a little bit of Brett Stellis. It's been compared to Bright Light's Big City and I could see that as well. But it's such an interesting book because. It's a woman's perspective. A young girl coming of age, also a Jewish girl in the midst of this, you know, lot of antisemitism that was existing then. It's a great, it's a great debut. So that's my first a gorgeous excitement. Yeah,

Renee:

I have a copy of that, but you, I totally forgot about it. So. You just sold it. And I remember reading about the preppy murder murderer. Yeah, I remember that. And that, I mean, it's not something I've thought about in years, but as soon as you said that, I remembered it

Brett Benner:

well and I immediately looked it up. Mm-hmm. I mean, you know, and I had to see what he looked like and kind of his hold he had on all these, on all these girls.

Renee:

Oh, wow. So, okay. I'm gonna definitely bump that up. All right. I, one of my next favorites is one of, one of my most recent reads. I actually read this after I did my, my quarterly chat with Katie. So this was not included and I, I benched this. It's a memoir. It is Bingeable. It's the Tell by Amy Griffin. Okay. I listened to the entire thing in one day. This is about, this is obviously Amy's story. It is her search for the truth to understand and begin to recover from buried childhood trauma. She interrogates the pursuit of her own perfectionism. I mean, she, she ran, she ran, she ran. She ran. And she never stopped to think, what am I possibly running from something. She was a type A control person and she really like, maintained an appearance of looking good, very driven, just a very type a perfectionist. And one day her daughter said something to her, and you know, I don't think it's, it's not a spoiler to say that. I think her daughter was 11 at the time, and she said, mom. You're nice, but we don't really know you. You're here but you're not here. And that set her on a path of, of a, of a journey to find out about more about herself. And in doing so, found out about this buried childhood trauma. So the. The pace of this memoir is unbelievable. I mean, when I tell you I had an, an AirPod in the entire day I had to go to, this was the day I had to go to the BMV because I found, I realized thanks to a postcard in the mail that my license expired. And I was like, oh my God. And I, I had to wait an hour and a half, didn't even care. I'm like, I don't care. I'm listening to this book. No problem. It was fascinating, her storytelling ability. It was, it was amazing. It was riveting. As someone who wasn't quite on her level of perfectionism, I, I saw myself in a lot of. What she described, and I think I'm a few years older than her, but she grew, you know, she grew up kind of in the eighties and so, mm-hmm. There was that whole, that whole part of it that I really enjoyed, you know, listening to her childhood, I thought that the way she structured this memoir was brilliant, and I am, I'm not gonna tell, I'm not gonna say anything else about it. But like I said, I was riveted and then, and I wasn't even sure I was going to read this and the, what kind of pushed me over into deciding I was gonna read this was her interview with Oprah.

Brett Benner:

Oh, okay. And

Renee:

I do, I don't tend to listen to interviews before I read the book. But in this case, listening to that interview pushed me right into deciding to read the book. So I, I loved it. I loved it. It's gonna be a favorite of the year. So that's the tell by Amy Griffin.

Brett Benner:

Okay, I'm gonna say this first. I listened to this on audio. And I loved it. And I actually think you liked this book too. It's read by the author and he does an incredible job. This book kind of blew me away'cause it's not even that long, but it so surprised me. The subject matter. I. Which I'll tell you in a second. But anyway, the book is Twist by Colin McCann. Yes. And I just thought this thing was so ingenious. But it says, A propulsive novel of rupture and repair in the digital age, delving into a hidden world deep under the ocean. So it's basically about this Irish journalist who gets assigned to cover this. Kind of ship captain who their job is to take these boats out and fix under the sea are these cable lines that. Carry all of our data and they're these thin like glass tubes that are filled with fiber optic cables. And look, my limited knowledge thought everything was in the air, right? I thought it was all satellites, and that's the way, you know, cell towers and satellites. I had no idea. These all existed in the ocean, and so one of them breaks and they have to go repair it. This journalist has his own kind of backstory, and there's a whole story that starts to develop between this man that he's supposed to be covering and his relationship with his, I don't remember if it's wife is who, if it's girlfriend and she's an actress in London, and of course when these people all go out in this. Boat, they're on this boat until they find the break and fix it. So it can be a while because it's not that easy. I, I found it so incredibly interesting and propulsive. I just thought it was great. And again, wasn't that long. So I was, I was riveted to the audio, but I went out this week and bought the, bought a copy of the book'cause I just thought this thing is, is fantastic. So it's twisted by Colin McCann.

Renee:

I second that it, I almost brought that as one of my surprise reads. Mm-hmm. I agree with everything you said. And also the author just killed the narration. Killed it, which doesn't. Hardly ever happened. I know. With fiction, right? At first I was like, oh no, the author's narrating. I know, but he was brilliant. Yeah. He did it. It it was so good. And I'm the same as you. I had no idea that, that those ran along the bottom of the ocean. And how Ter, it's terrifying to think. That because he did bring up, you know, acts of terrorism and Yeah, like what would happen if, you know, a lot of those were destroyed and are reliant on the internet, the banking systems, you know, like it could be a disaster. And I was listening to that book, thinking, oh my gosh, like what a scope of information that he covered. But he made it in, in. He made it so riveting, but to think about the ramifications of this, it was fascinating. And also the, the ship captain, I'm blanking on his name.

Brett Benner:

I could tell you.

Renee:

But the fact that he was a free diver, I thought that was really fascinating.

Brett Benner:

John Conway.

Renee:

Yeah, John. Okay. Wasn't that interesting about the free diving

Brett Benner:

the, the free diving. I was gonna mention that too, that I literally, again, it was all due to the writing and his reading where I found myself like driving the car, clutching the wheel. How

Renee:

you know?

Brett Benner:

Thinking when they were talking about like the bends and just the pressure and, and that feeling in your lungs. You've gotta get up and can you get up in time and Oh my God, it, I, I really was, I thought it was, it's everything to me. A good book should do, it should be informative. It should be riveting. It should have great characters. I thought it was great.

Renee:

Yeah. Okay. Second. Oh, that's a good one. Okay. All right. My next. My next favorite is a Backlist, and it is the Island of Missing Trees by LF Shaak. I listened to this one. I kind of did a combination. I mostly listened and I thought the audio was, was just fantastic. This is about two teenagers, a Greek CPR and a Turkish cpr, and they meet at a tavern on the island. They both call home. And at some point a tragedy ensues, and then decades later, one of them returns, searching for a native species, but also a lost love. It. Okay. This was, I had such an interesting reading experience with this book because really that right there is exactly something I would like. I love a complicated love story. I love a bittersweet love story. I love all of that. And I started this book on audio and I ended up reaching a point where I was like, I don't know if I'm into this. I it, there's also a. Another perspective in the book, which is a fig tree. And I, I was quite intrigued by that. But there was, I don't know what it was. I, I don't know what, what my mood was like. Okay, I'm gonna set this down for a couple days. I don't know if it's a DNF. Well, turns out I picked it. I could not stop thinking about the fig tree, so I picked it back up like two or three days later and just kept on going. And I absolutely loved it. And I really especially loved the fact that the trig, the fig tree, had her own perspective. Mm-hmm. She was an all-knowing philosophical narrator. She knew the whole story, but she only gave it to the reader. You know, in bits and pieces. Yeah. Which was brilliant. It was such a brilliant structure and it was a bittersweet love story. And I love, I just, I really loved it and I, I really loved her writing, but sometimes, sometimes you have to sit with something and you have to be patient, which I learned, like, I have to be patient and I have to, to stay with the story. So my, my reading intuition. Called me back to this and I just, I loved it. And who knew that a fig tree would capture me in 2025? Have you read this one?

Brett Benner:

I did read it, yeah. I loved this book. I loved this book. But it's funny'cause I read it long enough that I was hearing it. I was like, oh yeah.

Renee:

Do you remember the fig tree

Brett Benner:

completely? Yeah, I think she's an incredible writer. In fact, I just read the first, very first thing I read this year was, was her, her latest book, which has gone outta my head. The Rivers, yes. Yes. Yes. Is that right? Okay. Yes. Yes. I think she's a, I think she's a brilliant writer. She's also an incredible thinker and, um, point of view what she's saying about the world. I think she's truly gifted and a kind of amazing woman. Yeah. She's

Renee:

on, she has a sub stat newsletter.

Brett Benner:

Oh, she does? Mm-hmm.

Renee:

Yeah, so I, maybe I'll, I would love to connect with her sometime, but I downloaded her new book. So I will, I'll check that out at some point.

Brett Benner:

Yeah, it's epic and beautiful and genius. She's incredibly smart. That's a great choice. Okay, so my next, I'm trying to think which one I'm gonna do. Alright. My next book was something that I'd really wanted to read this year when it first came out and I didn't get to it immediately and then, and then I read it and I flipped. Out over it, which is Woodworking by Emily St. James. This is a book, it's so interesting because it's about a teacher in Mitchell, South Dakota who has decided to transition from male to female. So when the book opens, everything leads you to believe, and this is not really a spoiler, but everything leads you to believe that they have already transitioned and they're a woman. But none of it's happened yet. So. They are presenting still as a man. And it's not until you get a little further in the book that you realize, oh my gosh, he is still he. But what happens is there is a student in. His class who is trans, who is male to female, who has gone much further along and they forge this kind of unlikely relationship, friendship, where this student kind of is shepherding the teacher along. Now, the student whose name is Abigail is this very smart mouth sassy, take no prisoners, no bullshit. Kind of character and the teacher has an ex-wife'cause they've broken up, so she's in it as well. And so there's all these characters that kind of come into it. The young girl, Abigail, the the student, she has a boyfriend who is. Has been adopted from China and his parents, the, the, the adopted kid are kind of pillars in the community, but also very conservative when this is a conservative town. So it's kind of what happens with all of these characters come together. This is what I loved about the book because of everything that's happening in the US right now and how these attacks about trans people, which are so ridiculous and so absurd. For anyone who wants to kind of understand in any capacity what it's like for a person who realizes that they're in the wrong body. This is the book to get. It's not didactic, it's not heavy handed. In fact, so much of it is so funny that it really could play like a, almost like a. Comedy'cause it's really, really funny, but also extremely moving. Everyone that I've told to get this book has absolutely loved it. I just think it's, it's so fantastic and, and, and in a lot of ways I look at it as a, as a necessary book. I just think it's great. So that's Woodworking by Emily St. James.

Renee:

Okay, good. That's, I don't even know if I've heard of that. That's right under the radar.

Brett Benner:

It came out like three or four weeks ago in an easy, funny, I think you'd love it.

Renee:

Okay. And the audio was good.

Brett Benner:

I had friends who, just two different friends who just did the audio and they said, it's great. And it's like, well, it's not a full cast. There's more than one people. And Emily St. James reads one of the characters, the author. So I don't know. I don't know which one she does, but anyway. Okay.

Renee:

Alright. Good. Yeah. Okay. My, my next one is. Is nonfiction. I mean, I know. I was like, should I bring two nonfiction? But. It. Narrowing, narrowing, narrowing down five I had, it's gotta be there. So it's unreasonable hospitality. Mm-hmm. The remarkable power of giving people more than they expect by Will Gera. Mm-hmm. And like I said, now. This is a nonfiction business book, which I would never have thought I would read, let alone would be a favorite, but oh my gosh, was this so good? I listened to this one, and this is about Will and the fact that when he was 26, he took over the helm of 11 Madison Park in New York City, which at the time was a struggling two star restaurant. And then. 11 years later, it was named the best restaurant in the world. Wow. And how did that happen? And you have to read to find out, but this was. So good. And I love stories about New York City, especially New York City, fine dining and behind the scenes of restaurant life. That's just a, a sub genre that I really love. So I didn't really know how much this was about fine dining. I, I've never heard of 11 Madison Park. I haven't either, so I loved it. It's, it's behind the scenes, but it's also. It's also a really broader look at what it means to be hospitable and what does that mean to be unreasonably hospitable. And it made me think not only, I mean, as someone who puts content into the world, I mean, we all could. Could benefit from something that he talked about, but also I love, but from a customer service perspective, what I was listening to parts of this and I was like, gosh, this is really making me realize. How much I, how much poor customer service I accept, like, why am I tipping people who have not given me good customer service? And so it, it, it just makes you think about a lot. And, but I will say like, I mean, I love the behind the scenes of fine dining and how he was, he was so laser focused. On making that restaurant number one, and I love to read stories about underdogs and people who have these outrageous goals. And are able to achieve it. I think that's fascinating and that is what this book is about. And I do wanna shout out Meredith from currently reading, because she reviewed this, I, I wanna say last summer on currently reading. And I had not heard of it. I don't think it would've crossed my path. And at first when I heard the title, when she talked about it, I was like. Like, okay, well, I, I'm gonna listen because I, I pay close attention to what Meredith reviews, but then once I heard her full review, I immediately, I was like, I'm adding that to my TBR, and I just got to it in January and I loved it. It's a favorite of the year. I also, I listened to it, but I bought a print copy because I have so much to highlight. There's. There's just so, so much life wisdom in this book. So that's unreasonable hospitality, the remarkable power of giving people more than they expect by Will Guera.

Brett Benner:

That sounds great, and I've not heard of it at all. I love that. Okay, my next one is another one that I, I ended up buying after I, I didn't listen to this. I, I read it on. My Kindle and I was like, oh, I want this in my library. It is The Antidote by Karen Russell. Like a million years ago, I read Swamplandia, which was one of her first books, and I kind of remember the cover had an alligator on it, and I don't remember the book resonating with me in any way, but at the time, back then, I think the majority of what I was reading wasn't kind of the fic, but I'd heard enough about. This new book, which sounded interesting to me and it really is. And I think even though it has elements of magical realism in it, it's a pretty linear storytelling. But it's set during it set in a Nebraska during the Dust Bowl, first of all, she's such a beautiful, incredibly descriptive writer, but it's effectively five characters. And the first is a young. A girl who was being raised by her single mother who gets murdered, and she ends up going to live with her uncle, who is another one of the characters. Then. Into this story. The antidote is actually a prairie witch, which I guess these people existed, but her role is effectively, you go to this woman when you want to get rid of a memory. If there's something you can't deal with or you just don't want to think about anymore, you kind of unburden yourself to her and she quote unquote banks it and takes it from you and you forget. And so. All of these characters paths begin to cross. And then a young black woman shows up in the town who is a photographer who is working for the government to record America at this point during the depression and the Dust Bowl, but her camera has this special ability to be able to. See things that are no longer there. And one of the things that the camera starts to pick up on is the indigenous people that lived on the land that the Americans drove out. So I. A, a large part of the bigger story here is about colonization, but it's also about power and corruption. Mm-hmm. So there's a lot going on, and I've made it sound almost more complicated than it is, but. All of these stories kind of weaved and they all kind of come together. I thought it was amazing. It's epic, but also intimate. All of these characters were so fascinating to me. It's incredible how relevant some of it is, even with things happening today in terms of politics, in terms of how absolute power causes absolute corruption. I'm gonna say great yarn,

Renee:

but it really

Brett Benner:

is. So that's the antidote by Karen Russell.

Renee:

Okay. Ooh. Yeah, I, that sounds, that sounds interesting. Okay, so I have saved my top book for last.

Brett Benner:

Okay. Okay. And it

Renee:

is Slanting Towards the Sea by Sia Hill, Jay, and it comes out July 8th. Okay. So summer book, but get your pre-orders in, because I really hope that this is. Quote unquote, a popular summer read. But this one is a set over 20 years, so it's spanning 20 years and one life altering summer in Croatia. And it is an unforgettable love story and a powerful exploration of what it means to come of age in a country younger than oneself. So, like I said, at its core, it is a complicated love story. It revolves around Ivana and her great love, Val. It's also a father daughter love story, and it is a love story of one's homeland and of new beginnings. There are a lot of themes going on in this story, but that it, it adds so much depth to what is already. A beautiful story. Her writing for me was literary perfection. It is. Wow. Gorgeous. I love her writing. This is a debut. I read this by the pool in Cancun in February. I think it is a perfect like summer, beach read, pool, read. And it's different. It's unique. I mean, there are a lot of love triangles in happening. I think in literature this, this first quarter, I mean, we've got Dream State by Eric Puchner

Brett Benner:

which I still have to read, broken

Renee:

Country by Claire Leslie Hall. This is also a, there is a love trial, love triangle aspect to the story, but it's different than the others. I love a love triangle. I, I mean, if you tell me there's a love triangle, I don't need to know anything else about this story. You're like,

Brett Benner:

you had me at Love Triangle. You. That's it.

Renee:

And I really like the unique angle that the author took with this story. And there's also a really an ode to, to. Nature and the land. There's just so much. I really think people who enjoy literary fiction especially are going to love this book. It is Slanting Towards the Sea by Sia Hill. Jay,

Brett Benner:

I'm, I am so in. I am so in. Oh gosh. You

Renee:

have to pull up the cover. The cover's gorgeous. There's a really great story that she tells about the serendipity of getting that cover.

Brett Benner:

I'm typing so fast. I'm like, oh, there it is. Oh, wow. Beautiful.

Renee:

And that the, the cover is illustrated by a Croatian artist, and they didn't know each other, but just, it's, it's a great story.

Brett Benner:

Oh, that's awesome. All right. I'm so in. Okay, so my last that I am focusing on is also, it's not out yet. This is going to be out April 15th. It is a fiction debut, although the author has published other works and we were talking about that earlier. Some people have other things. So this is actually his, his fiction debut. The book is called Open Heaven. The author is Sean Hewitt. He's an Irish writer, Sean Hewitt. Wrote a biography a few years ago called All Down Darkness Wide, which I read before this, which was also fantastic about him being in a relationship with someone with an addiction problem and what kind of happened. He is a poet, first and foremost, and I have, first of all, I love Irish writers. I just think they write such incredible books and I'm also such a big fan of. Poets who then write prose because I think it's, it's absolutely beautiful. Like Garth Greenwell and Ocean Vuoung, and this is another example of that. So this is like this simple story. It it's, it's a very, not a very long book, but it's about this young boy named James, who's living in a very small town who's shy, 16 years old, kind of coming to terms with his sexuality and realizing he's gay. And one day. He is his father forces him to get a job working on a milk delivery truck where the guy in the town kind of drives him around. He runs up and puts the milk on the porch, and there is at the neighbor's house, a new young guy who's there helping out, who apparently is quote unquote troubled. And this boy's parents have sent him to live with, I, I think it's his uncle and his aunt to kind of get it together for the, for the summer, for the year. So they. Develop a friendship, and so the book is really about this young kid who really falls desperately in love with this guy. Who is straight. So there's no, there's no chance that it's going to develop into this blossoming romance. It, it really is very much, if I have one adjective to attach to this book, it's longing and the entire book so incredibly well captures that feeling that you have when you are. So enamored with somebody, but how does it get reciprocated or how does it get returned in a way that is satisfying and fulfilling, and how does it not? How do you not upend the apple cart by either pushing something too far or confessing something? It's so. Heartbreaking and beautiful, and so self-assured and just really, really gorgeous and kind of the way that like Call Me By Your Name is gorgeous and I just thought it was, I think he's such a crazy, talented writer and just a simple, really beautiful debut. I loved it. Okay, so that's Open Heaven by Sean Hewitt, and it will be out April 15th. So

Renee:

pre-order.

Brett Benner:

Ooh.

Renee:

Okay. I am going to, I'm gonna get right on net galley when we're finished. Yeah. Because I know I've seen that, but I know I've seen the cover, but for whatever reason, I, I didn't even like read the synopsis or anything, but I love what you had to say. And I'm also now wondering what happens. Yeah, it's, I wanna know what, what happens when you're in that situation and does he. Ru, like I'm assuming maybe they end up friends, but do you ruin a friendship? And I need, I'm just, I'm very curious. Yeah, no, it's great. About this story. Okay. Ooh, those are some really great

Brett Benner:

choices. They

Renee:

are choices.

Brett Benner:

Okay. No, wait. You had one, you had two. Talk about the surprise for you.

Renee:

Okay. I have two and I'll be quick because I can decide on just one. So the first book that, that really surprised me. Was Raising Hair, A memoir by Chloe Dalton.

Brett Benner:

It, it's so funny'cause I almost did the same

Renee:

one. Really? Yeah. I didn't know you read this. Oh my gosh. That's my one

Brett Benner:

nonfiction. Yeah.

Renee:

Oh, oh, I love that. Okay, so I love animals. That's not too surprising to me, but what is surprising to me. Is the fact that this is about so much more than just a woman who decide who, who makes a choice to help an injured hair one day. I mean, that is what she did. But I was so surprised by how unique this story actually is and when it, it's described as a magical, true story of a woman in an injured hair. Who taught her how to live again. And it is exactly that. And when I finished, I thought, oh my gosh, this is, this is a time when the pub, when the publisher's use of the word magical actually really applies. Mm-hmm. I loved everything about this story and I almost, I almost did not pick it up because I was worried. I, I tend to worry that something bad. Is gonna happen where I cannot read about it. But thanks to Katie, a basic bees guide who let me know that not only I would like it, but I would be okay reading it. So I'm here to tell everyone else you don't, you'll be okay if you are, you know, worried about animal, sensitive, about the right, if you're sensitive to animal, animal stories. But, and, and it's beautiful. I loved it. It's so beautiful. It surprised me in. Just about every way, the storytelling, what, what her experience actually ended up being. I'm trying not to spoil anything about the story, but what actually ended up happening was amazing.

Brett Benner:

Have you been to her? Have you been to her Instagram?

Renee:

No, I haven't been. Oh my

Brett Benner:

God. Oh my God. You have to go to her Instagram. Oh my gosh.'cause she has all of the pictures and videos and you see the hair and it, it, that scene, that hair, I was so moved. Like I. I don't know. I just was like, I listened to this on audio and basically one shot like driving,'cause it's not a long book. Mm-hmm. Driving from Los Angeles to the desert and I just kind of like was enveloped and it's, I don't know if you listened to it or read it. I

Renee:

listened to it. Okay. And then, yeah. And she is

Brett Benner:

phenomenal. The woman who reads it. Right. And there's also a great afterwards where she interviews the author, which I loved. Mm-hmm.

Renee:

I did

Brett Benner:

too. I just was so kind of wrapped up in her voice and I was so there, but I'm telling you, you've gotta go into Instagram'cause you'll like it. It brings it all into like 3D, you know what I mean?

Renee:

Okay, I will do that. I, I saw a picture of the actual hare but it wasn't on her Instagram, so I need to go back. I didn't even think about going to Instagram. Yeah, yeah. I will do that. And

Brett Benner:

so I just got lost. I like went down and then I was like, I want a hare

Renee:

well, I will, I'll share with you, I just finished this morning listening to her interview. On the Poured over podcast. Okay. Just Barnes and Noble and it was, it was really good. It's a good interview.

Brett Benner:

I just saw it was just shortlisted for the women's prize for nonfiction. Oh really? So it just got short? Yeah, it just got shortlisted for that. I think we're gonna see more of it and I bet by the end of the year it's gonna be on a lot of year end lists for nonfiction. Just'cause I think it, I think it is touching a lot of people who are discovering it. But I think it's helping that we're talking about it.'cause Yeah, I think it's great and I think it needs, you know, it's one of those things where you want it to have a bigger audience.

Renee:

Yes, absolutely. Okay, so I'll tell you really quickly. Sure. My other surprise book is Blue Light Hours by Bruna Dantes Lovato, which is a debut, came out in 2024, but I just read it in in January. So it's the debut novel of a young Brazilian woman's first year in America. A continent away from her lonely mother and the relationship they build over Skype across like call, over Skype, calls across borders. The reason this is so surprising for me is because it's, it's 192 pages and I never expected to love a book that is basically a mother and daughter talking across Skype. And that's what happened. And not a lot happens, but so much happens. It packs a really powerful emotional punch. Her writing just made me stop in my tracks several times. I listened to this. It's beautiful. And so shout out to Sarah Hildreth, who really championed this book and. So Sarah is a reader I trust in general, but whenever she raves about a mother-daughter book, which she did in the fall for this one, I put it, you know, right into my TBR and I pulled it out in January and I'm just so, so surprised at what the author was able to do in only 192 pages. So that's Blue Light Hours by Bruna Dantes Lovato.

Brett Benner:

That sounds great.

Renee:

I think you would like it. What surprised you?

Brett Benner:

My surprise is a backlist book, which which came out last year and it's funny because I was sent a copy of it from Celadon and never read it, but never got rid of it because the cover intrigued me so much, and it's called Devil Is Fine by John Cher. And then this year it was long listed for the Aspen Words prize. And Aspen Words Prize is, is actually one of my favorite of the lit prizes. You know, their whole thing is to showcase stories that represent the human experience. And so when it was on there and I had it, I was like, oh, this is perfect. I'm gonna read it. And. First of all, I'm gonna show you the cover, which our, which our listeners can't see it, but it's a group of jellyfish, which looks like dirt in the middle. And so I had no sense of what it was. I'll read you this little blurb. It says, from acclaimed novelist, John Vercher a poignant story of what it means to be a father, a son, a writer, and a biracial American fighting to reconcile the past. So effectively what it is, is it's about this. Father, who's also, he's a writer who is struggling with his next book. His son has tragically died, which we don't know how that will reveal itself later. He's since split up with his wife. He, when his son dies, he finds out that his father had left his property down south to his son. And so since his son is no longer alive, he is going to collect on it. But when he arrives down south to this house, they find in the backyard human remains and Oh wow. It seems that. His, the house and this property was a plantation that held slaves and so it's this man kind of coming to terms with his ancestors' past, while also coming to terms with his son's death. It is really good. I listened to it on audio and it took me a moment to kind of tap in a little bit because of the reader, but. Ultimately, I, I loved his reading of it. It just took me a little bit to get into his voice, into the rhythm of it, which happens sometimes with, with books, with books on tape, I should say. But ultimately, I thought. Uh, this is something I ne wouldn't have necessarily even picked up. I'm so glad I held onto it and, and again, that's why I'm thankful so many times for these book prizes because they do highlight things that you think, okay, well enough people think it's worthy. Lemme check it out. And it absolutely was. So a, a, a really engaging, moving and at times very funny book as well, but really interesting cast of characters. Good book Devil Is Fine by John Vercher

Renee:

oh, okay. I've never heard of that. And, and I will

Brett Benner:

say this, my big question when I started into it was I was like, what are the jellyfish? It'll all make sense.

Renee:

Okay. Yeah. When you said the title, I would never have have thought that it would have jellyfish on the cover. No.

Brett Benner:

Well, I kept thinking like, why? This is about a man who goes Right. And it, it all comes out, so

Renee:

Okay. But very interesting. It's eye catching.

Brett Benner:

Yeah. Yeah. And

Renee:

oh, I love that. Okay. And you made me realize I need to go check out the Aspen.

Brett Benner:

Yeah, they just, I think they're on their, they have their short list now. Okay. So, and I've read I think five of the six. There's one I haven't read yet, but it's a, it's a decent list this year. Well, this has been so amazing as usual and I think we've given our listeners a treasure trove of of books to explore and check out and get and read. Yes and yes. I think we're gonna have to do at at least probably another halfway point, check in to see if things change and if things knock out. I love that when you say to do would love to,

Renee:

to do that.

Brett Benner:

So thank you. So much for being here. Always a pleasure talking to you. We can go on forever, so you know when you get talking about books.

Renee:

I know. Well, thanks for having me and I will look forward to checking in with you in the future.

Brett Benner:

Absolutely. And of course I will have all of Renee's information below if you don't already have her. Where to follow her, where to find her. Check out her substack for sure. And of course my bookshop.org page will have all of the titles we've talked about, so you can check that out as well. But alright, Renee, I will see you soon.

Renee:

Okay, see you later. Bye.

Brett Benner:

Thank you everybody for listening, and once again, if you're liking what you're hearing, please consider liking and subscribing at your podcast platform of choice and also consider leaving a review. Reviews are incredibly helpful in getting podcasts seen and making sure that they have a more prominent position on these platforms, so I would really appreciate it. Okay, everybody, I'll see you next week.